What did Meadow say after she opened the door at Holsten's?

[conkom]

We can be certain these were the last two words Tony heard.

What were they?

[dsweeney]

You and I are of one mind as to the ending, for sure. But surely if Meadow said anything we would have heard it? If Tony heard anything we would have, no? From memory there is about 2 to 3 seconds between the bell on the door and the cut to black. Not enough time for Meadow to react to what she's seeing, IMO. And it's quite a distance from the door to the booth Tony and the others are sitting in as well so she would have to fairly shout it out loud for him to hear. In which case again I say, WE would hear. Unless I'm missing some link to a previous scene, Meadow pulling him back from death in the coma sequence say, we can only surmise as to what she may or may not have said. But just to run with it what about ..."Look out!!".

[conkom]

Perhaps Journey's song blaring from the jukebox might have drowned out her voice.

But therein lies the clue.

[dsweeney]

Are you touching on the "never hear it when it happens" idea again maybe? That again, Tony doesn't hear it ? Whatever IT is ? If that evening in Holsten's had panned out it's possible to my thinking that Meadow would have said "I'm pregnant" and it would have been the happiest night of Tony's life. But that's all conjecture. It didn't pan out like that, IMO. You'll have to help me along on this I'm afraid.

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

We can be certain these were the last two words Tony heard.

What were they?

Conkom, why do you insist on purveying gratuitous, dictatorial pronouncements about Tony's "death" at every turn? You started a thread wondering what Meadow says on entering the restaurant but then had to follow it up with "we can be certain these are the last two words Tony ever heard." The latter is totally irrelevant to the former, ostensibly real question of the thread and serves no purpose except to once again try to beat into submission those who don't agree that Tony necessarily died in Holsten's.

Why is it so important to you to have everyone else affirm your point of view? Why do you insist that "we" (meaning everyone) "can be certain" these were the last words Tony ever heard? Why aren't you secure enough in your own interpretation to let this go and not artificially inject it into discussion at every opportunity?

There's a fundamental scent of provocation and arrogance in the way you (and some others) keep bringing this up and particularly in the words you choose to convey it. I'm asking you to please be more considerate and less redundant. If you want to once again do battle on the issue of Tony's death, confine such remarks to one of the countless other threads that were formed expressly for that purpose or that devolved once again into that debate.

[conkom]

I am not sure why creating a thread that relates to the final episode on this board is a problem. And it is a new topic that has not been discussed which would make it off-topic in any other thread.

And fly I am not being provocative. Nor am I making dictatorial pronouncements. Just say that a paradigm has been formulated in which some pretty definitive conclusions can be drawn. (I am not talking about the last words. That will come later).

You have put together probably the best message board on the Sopranos. You and your fellow moderators have been able to keep a lid on the ongoing discussions and prevent it becoming a foul mouthed war between monumental egos (which might reflect what much of the Sopranos is really all about). And I also think you have helped me put a lid on mine.

Is it important to have everyone affirm what is my point of view? Of course not. I am sure most of us have more important things to do then speculate whether or not Tony was whacked.

But it is fun and it is all part of the game. Isn't that the theory?

Chase (whom this board is named after) left us with an ending that represents not just a conclusion of a series but a culmination of what became a popular cultural phenomenon.


So what were the last words Tony heard and could have been said by Meadow as she entered Holsten's...


Don't (as in don't shoot)


Stop (as in stop shooting).


Don't stop

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

I am not sure why creating a thread that relates to the final episode on this board is a problem. And it is a new topic that has not been discussed which would make it off-topic in any other thread.

Please re read my post. I was not at all criticizing a thread devoted to imagining what Meadow might have said upon entering the restaurant, only the completely unnecessary, irrelevant, and, yes, provocative gratuity (vis-a-vis that subject matter) that "we can be certain they were the last words Tony ever heard." They are independent issues, and I'm at a loss to understand any legitimate aim for the authoritative edict of outcome in your language other than to subtly jab at those who don't share your belief that Tony died (or who don't find comfort in drawing a conclusion one way or the other on that issue).

If the question is what did Meadow say upon entering the restaurant, I have no idea. I'd guess it was something like "sorry I'm late", unless Tony was in fact shot in front of her before she could say anything, which surely would have elicited screams of horror from her.

If the question is what were that last words Tony ever heard in his life assuming that he died in Holsten's, it clearly could have been Steve Perry's "Don't Stop", but by then he may not have been really listening to the song (ergo, he didn't "hear" them). He was known to be pretty oblivious to other stimuli when he was eating, and I don't think Journey could command his senses quite like a hot, crispy golden onion ring.

If the question is what meaning Chase might have intended with the juxtaposition of "don't stop" with the assumed execution of Tony, I'm more inclined to think it aligns with his comments in the interview where he mentions the myth of Sysiphus, something like "we must all go on believing that there is a purpose to life, acting like people who would love" even though that hopeful message may conflict with what intellectual delving suggests.

[dsweeney]

[QUOTE=conkom;24928]I am not sure why creating a thread that relates to the final episode on this board is a problem. And it is a new topic that has not been discussed which would make it off-topic in any other thread.

And fly I am not being provocative. Nor am I making dictatorial pronouncements. Just say that a paradigm has been formulated in which some pretty definitive conclusions can be drawn. (I am not talking about the last words. That will come later).

You have put together probably the best message board on the Sopranos. You and your fellow moderators have been able to keep a lid on the ongoing discussions and prevent it becoming a foul mouthed war between monumental egos (which might reflect what much of the Sopranos is really all about). And I also think you have helped me put a lid on mine.

Is it important to have everyone affirm what is my point of view? Of course not. I am sure most of us have more important things to do then speculate whether or not Tony was whacked.

But it is fun and it is all part of the game. Isn't that the theory?

Chase (whom this board is named after) left us with an ending that represents not just a conclusion of a series but a culmination of what became a popular cultural phenomenon.


So what were the last words Tony heard and could have been said by Meadow as she entered Holsten's...


Don't (as in don't shoot)


Stop (as in stop shooting).


Don't stop[/QUOTE

In my opinion the last words Tony Soprano heard, if as Fly says he was even listening to the music, were "don't stop". But they weren't spoken by Meadow, they were sung by the singer in Journey. And my personal take on it is that whatever Tony wants to believe himself, life doesn't go on forever, the movie doesn't go "on and on". And IMO it's a cruel irony by Chase that the last song Tony plays is this one.