References to Future Episodes

[Universal Polymath]

Well, slow start to the review discussion around here, eh? Hope it picks up with the coming episodes. I know the pilot episode like the back of my hand, but decided to watch it again earlier this evening, just to get into the spirit of things.

A few (very few) observations. At least one I've posted elsewhere, but might as well repeat it here.

- Chris was wearing a baseball cap while driving Tony around in the pilot, perhaps the purpose of the cap in his final scene - Turns out it was never revealed that that hat contained a wire, so I guess it was just a nice touch without much consequence. In Chris’ first episode, Tony makes first mention of his uncertainty about his nephew to Melfi, and in his last episode, Tony acts upon that uncertainty by killing him.

- Of course, I've heard it mentioned already that we get a glimpse of the Cleaver Logo right there in the pilot, when Chris kills his first, Emil Kolar (and while "I'm a Man" plays - how appropriate).

- As Tony prepares to tell Carmela about his therapy and Prozac prescription, he utters the line "Always with the drama" (after she puts her wine in position to "throw in his damn face"). In the finale, as Carmela explains what could happen to A.J. if he joined the army, he also replies with, "Always with the drama". I can't name the episode, but I know Johnny Soprano also said this to Livia, I can hear his voice and line reading in my head. Perhaps "Always with the drama" was to Johnny as "Poor you" was to Livia?

- I found it interesting that Junior remembered playing catch with Tony before anything else in "Made in America". Surely he has no memory of playing catch with the huge hulk of a human being that Tony became, but rather a much smaller boy that I'm surprised he was able to connect with adult-Tony in the asylum. A quick reminder in the pilot, though, establishes how strongly Junior associates Tony, always his "little nephew", with the activity of playing catch (and it's one of the funniest lines in the episode, too: "You may run North Jersey, but you don't run you Uncle Junior. How many fuckin' hours did I spend playing catch with you?!")

- The criticism that is such a tremendous blow to Tony's self-esteem (that he never had the making of a varsity athlete), is brought up several times later in the series, and is the very thing that an absent-minded Junior repeats to set Tony off in "Where's Johnny?".

And there's a start, there are plenty more obvious ones, and probably plenty of not-so-obvious ones (those being the most fun to find), too. Anyone care to add to my humble start of a list?

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

Great post, UP.

I watched with my brother and stayed late at his house, thus my late arrival at this thread. I think billymac commented that he would primarily begin discussions on Mondays. So I think things will pick up.:icon_wink: I'm pretty tired myself right now, so I'll probably wait until tomorrow to offer more thoughts, but you've certainly given us a great start.

[Garth]

One of the great things about this episode (rewatching it for the upteenth time as I am writing this), is that, despite the continuity issues, it appears as these characters have been living and breathing for the past 40 years of Tony's life (and then before that with Livia & Junior's generation). What made me think of this, is a very subtle gesture when Tony is discussing the Mahaffey situation with Hesh.

As Silvio tells the waitress that the drinks are on the house, Tony glances in her direction with a shocked expression. Without ANY words this explains to the viewer that Tony and his crew get everything handed to them and is thrown off guard when even the idea of paying for drinks (which they COULD do). It suggests a history that these characters shared.

Also, I love the smaller points of this episode. As Artie rebuffs Tony's tickets at the garbage dump, we see Chris & Paulie in the background (completely out of focus) preparing to play basketball. These details are really why I love about the Sopranos. They make the world three dimensional, and allow the characters to live and breath in that world.

I do find some of the scenes to be a tad out of character from future portrayals. Carm seems to be much more judgemental (and running outside with an AK47 is a completely different character from what we see later in the show). On the other hand, as an arc, her character, season by season, becomes blinded, more and more, by greed and ignorance. So I guess, seeing her openly judging Tony and his life, is a bit of a shock, after seeing her so close-minded and ignorant at the end of the series.

Ok, well those are my thoughts for now, I really hope more board members jump on. This should be a great 86 weeks!

[bobC]

The scenes with Livia/Tony (the overbearing/tyrannical mother), Livia/Junior (the influential mob widow), Livia/Carmela (the persecuted mother-in-law) were classic in defining her character and her role in the series.

I wonder how different the series would have been had Chase not been forced to make detours because of Marchand's illness and ultimate death.

[bobC]

I hope I'm not going overboard here, but I just became aware, after watching it maybe ten times, of the song that played over the credits as The Pilot ended. Here are the lyrics to "The Beast In Me." Very interesting song Chase used to end the first episode.

Beast in Me Lyrics - Nick Lowe

The beast in me
Is caged by frail and fragile bonds
Restless by day
And by night, rants and rages at the stars
God help, the beast in me
The beast in me
Has had to learn to live with pain
And how to shelter from the rain
And in the twinkling of an eye
Might have to be restrained
God help the beast in me

Sometimes
It tries to kid me that it's just a teddy bear
Or even somehow managed
To vanish in the air
And that is when I must beware
Of the beast in me
That everybody knows
They've seen him out dressed in my clothes
Patently unclear
If it's New York or New Year
God help the beast in me
The beast in me

[mperkins605]

In the first episode Carmela is shown getting money from a fake soup can. In the next to last episode while preparing to flee to the safe house Tony is shown filling a trash bag with soup cans.

[Universal Polymath]

In the first episode Carmela is shown getting money from a fake soup can. In the next to last episode while preparing to flee to the safe house Tony is shown filling a trash bag with soup cans.

Wow, great catch!

[ChristophersRelapse]

That is an awesome catch. I didn't know this was going down. I'm excited to bust out my season 1 dvd's! I'm going to have to borrow the rest from my cousin it would seem. This site keeps the show alive. Fly you're amazing.

[badabellisima]

Ditto on great catch mperkins! (Like on Big Love, a main pair of Mormon characters stashes huge amounts of cash in fake cans of pea soup, and they exchange money in terms of 'ten cans of pea soup', etc.) What kind of soup was it again- that Tony and Carmella were stashing? was that same soup used or referred to elsewhere anyone remember? would've been a good trivia question. :icon_razz:

[JoeyBagadonuts]

What kind of soup was it again- that Tony and Carmella were stashing? was that same soup used or referred to elsewhere anyone remember? would've been a good trivia question. :icon_razz:

Campbell's. Minestrone, I think. Like any self-respecting Italian woman would have a can of that in her shelf :icon_mrgreen:

[mperkins605]

I'm in process of reviewing each episode, paying close attention to detail that I either missed the first time or didn't realize the importance. I'm about half way through second season. During a scene in the first season the lamp with diamond shapes that Sil was working to repair in one of the last shows is shown in the background. It's the one Tony smashed as things were falling apart. Speaking of lamps, has anyone figured out why Chase spent so much time bugging the lamp in Tony's basement only to have the storyline drop when Meadow took the lamp to college? I suspect it was just the first of many plots dropped similar to the missing Russian. As we review all of the shows keep an eye out for dropped storylines.

[bobC]

I guess this could be considered an inconsistency or perhaps just a mistake. In the pilot, the schlub known as Mahaffey (with his taffy) couldn't possibly have accrued $250k in gambling debts to Hesh. IMO Mahaffeys kneecaps would have been long gone well before he got into them for a quarter of a million.

Yet down the road in "Chasing It" when Tony "borrowed" $200k from Hesh it was like a BIG deal.

[Garth]

I'm in process of reviewing each episode, paying close attention to detail that I either missed the first time or didn't realize the importance. I'm about half way through second season. During a scene in the first season the lamp with diamond shapes that Sil was working to repair in one of the last shows is shown in the background. It's the one Tony smashed as things were falling apart. Speaking of lamps, has anyone figured out why Chase spent so much time bugging the lamp in Tony's basement only to have the storyline drop when Meadow took the lamp to college? I suspect it was just the first of many plots dropped similar to the missing Russian. As we review all of the shows keep an eye out for dropped storylines.

I think that was just another sign to show us how lucky Tony has really been over the years. In retrospect very few of the plot lines that Chase brought up really had a huge impact on the show. I mean, look at the Furio story. Really...his sole purpose was to create a sense of friction between Tony & Carm. Nowhere near what we were expecting. This story is driven by characters, not plot. Which is different then any other show I've seen. Despite the FBI's best efforts, Tony was never caught (to the best of our knowledge). And the important part is the dramatic irony that this gives the viewers.

[madribub]

- As Tony prepares to tell Carmela about his therapy and Prozac prescription, he utters the line "Always with the drama" (after she puts her wine in position to "throw in his damn face"). In the finale, as Carmela explains what could happen to A.J. if he joined the army, he also replies with, "Always with the drama". I can't name the episode, but I know Johnny Soprano also said this to Livia, I can hear his voice and line reading in my head. Perhaps "Always with the drama" was to Johnny as "Poor you" was to Livia?



Hey. The episode in question is Down Neck, during the final flashback scene where Livia threatens to smother the children if Johnny takes them to Nevada. At least I think so. I just finished watching the first season.

[Garth]

I hope I'm not going overboard here, but I just became aware, after watching it maybe ten times, of the song that played over the credits as The Pilot ended. Here are the lyrics to "The Beast In Me." Very interesting song Chase used to end the first episode.

Beast in Me Lyrics - Nick Lowe

The beast in me
Is caged by frail and fragile bonds
Restless by day
And by night, rants and rages at the stars
God help, the beast in me
The beast in me
Has had to learn to live with pain
And how to shelter from the rain
And in the twinkling of an eye
Might have to be restrained
God help the beast in me

Sometimes
It tries to kid me that it's just a teddy bear
Or even somehow managed
To vanish in the air
And that is when I must beware
Of the beast in me
That everybody knows
They've seen him out dressed in my clothes
Patently unclear
If it's New York or New Year
God help the beast in me
The beast in me




This has always been one of my absolute favorite songs from this show. And since the music Chase typically used, appealed to me, this is saying alot. I just feel like it epitomizes the series or at least Tony's character. Always loved this song, and always thought it would have been cool (if the series didn't end the way it did) for the final song to have been the same one.

My one complaint with this musical choice is a retroactive complaint. As FoMW has stated (and I will do my best to paraphrase here), Chase, as the series progressed, seemed to become discouraged by how many viewers saw Tony as in such a positive light. And this final season put the exemplified how Chase feels about Tony. And it itsn't positive. Well, if anything this song is a sympathetic, poem to an individual's frailty and the human condition. So, Chase planted the seed in viewer's minds of Tony as being a sympathetic anti-hero.

Now, these are all FoMW's points, let me be clear about that, but I completely agree, and I think this song is an excellent portrayal of how Chase might have felt in regards to Tony at the beginning of the series, but his opinion changed as the series progressed. Either that, OR Chase played us like a fiddle from the very beginning. Or perhaps it is a little of both.

[dad1153]

Have you guys heard the commentary track with David Chase and Peter Bogdanovich on the DVD of the Pilot? It was recorded back in 2000 and it clears lots of misgivings about the early mythology of the show. I'm listening to it as I'm typing this and its very interesting. I'm surprised by how few people with DVD's of movies they claim to love have never heard commentary tracks.

[lfilipe]

the shirt tony is wearing when artie gives back the tickets to tony is the same as in made in america last escene?
lol i just re-watched the episode its obviously not