The Aftermath of Bobby's First Kill

[gmcz71offroad]

I think there could possibly be a situation with the guy ripping the piece of bobbys shirt off with dna evidence, I might be wrong though.

Great start to the new season. From the previews of next weeks show looks like some interesting things are going to happen, especially the part the showed agent harris and the other guy talking to tony at the end of his driveway.

[proimagemaker]

Also related to the shooting is Janice telling Bobby to get rid of any "hollow point" bullets in his gun. Most likely did not before he went to Winnepeg that weekend. Any thoughts on the bullet getting back to the FBI, now in charge of Tony's gun case, could they be the same and therefor linked?

[khope07]

Kinda felt a little sad for Bobby....I think he regretted it? But he did it to prove his loyalty.

Great song at the end....fitted perfectly.

[zellar1]

i dont think it will turn out to be much at all, first off Bobby will get rid of any evidence from the crime, second it was in Canada or just near the border. the FBI would not even have this on the radar, it will be a real reach. Third, the FBI has been so f***ing dumb throught the series that i would really doubt that now they would be actully smart. if anything it will just be a riff between bobby and tony, but really i think it woulnt turn out to be much.

[Cassata]

Also related to the shooting is Janice telling Bobby to get rid of any "hollow point" bullets in his gun. Most likely did not before he went to Winnepeg that weekend. Any thoughts on the bullet getting back to the FBI, now in charge of Tony's gun case, could they be the same and therefor linked?

Not only could they be linked...but if it was the same type of bullet, and Tony was arrested for the hit, I don't see Bobby stepping up to take the fall.

[Splishak]

I wonder if he might have shot Harpo?

If so, I hope Janice gets so distraught that she puts a bullet into her brain. She just ruins the whole series for me.

[WhoeverDidThis1130]

Sorry to hear Janice ruins the whole series for you, I think Aida Turturro's one of the best actresses on the show and her character is hilarious.

"You let him win...smart"
etc etc

[veddertrey]

For the piece of shirt to come back and haunt bobby....there would need to be 2 things:
1. skin or hair on the shirt--> which is almost a certainty
2. bobby would have to have his dna in the fbi database or he would have to be a person of interest who would be subpoenaed into submitting his dna...and chances are the local Canadian police are not gonna search the entire american dna database, cause even a 2 person comparative dna analysis takes 2 weeks ....

and from what i gather from religiously watching the episodes on dvd...bobby hasnt ever been arrested at least from the stories presented on dna....


so i think he is cool

[Universal Polymath]

In the beginning of the episode, Tony makes it clear to Bobby that he feels that he can depend on Christopher less and less. While the heir apparent for several years now, Christopher’s lack of devotion – and diverging interests – have left Tony uncertain that his nephew can effectively carry the family after Tony’s gone. Unfortunately, this realization about Chris couldn’t have come at a worse time for Tony. He feels old and tired, and seems to recognize the end of his tenure as boss approaching rapidly. At a time when he feels the need to solidify someone in the position to take charge of the family, Tony feels that he must turn to someone else. And that someone turns to be his brother-in-law Bobby. His brother-in-law is a loyal, dependable soldier – a man whom Tony decides deserves more responsibility and a chance to step up.

However, the next responsibility Bobby is given is to commit murder, something he has managed to avoid for his entire life. Tony, feeling threatened and bitter about being beaten up by Bobby the night before, vindictively uses Bobby’s pride in never having killed another human being against him. And being the loyal person Bobby is, he commits the deed – despite his extreme desire not to. The act clearly shakes Bobby up. He isn’t a hardened killer like his peers, desensitized to even the most grizzly acts of violence. Bobby is hesitant and timid, as he not only commits an act he never wanted to do himself, but knew his father always wanted him to avoid as well. The episode ends with Bobby reuniting with his family, but through his warm smile, we can see a change in his face. He seems regretful, remorseful, and we see just how quickly one can be sucked into Tony Soprano's world of uncertainty, lament, and evil. And kudos to Steve Schirripa, by the way, as that thoughtful gaze he gives at the end is eerie as hell! Almost as strikingly hard and chilling as Gandolfini’s signature stare.

So what effect will taking another life have on Bobby's psyche now? He has been unquestionably devoted to the life in the past, but never at a time when he was put in such a compromising and psychologically-damaging situation. Will Bobby forever resent Tony for knowingly forcing him to “pop his cherry”? Will he attempt to gradually isolate himself from his boss, in an attempt to isolate himself from the possibility of having to commit such an act again? I can see Bobby – hopelessly rueful and troubled by the killing – begin to try to distance himself from the life. He was comfortable within that world, only as long as he never committed murder, but that is something he can no longer tell himself, which could really destroy him.

What effect will this change have on his new position in Tony’s eyes? Tony will most likely find Bobby too weak to carry on his legacy, and find Bobby as unsuitable for the position as Christopher. Of course, this would be a detrimental blow to Tony; what a terrible thing, to be on the way out without having anyone around him fit to take over. It would leave Tony in an extremely unfavorable position, made worse only by the fact that he will know it was his own actions – motivated by his trivial need for revenge – that brought about that position. Even as he tried to convince himself that Bobby was too weak and unfit, he would still struggle with his own part in his brother-in-law’s downfall. Who would be next in line, if not Christopher or Bobby? Silvio would appear to be next in line, but he discovered last year just how heavy the crown lies, when he proved to be in no way able to deal with the stress of being boss. Paulie? He is a great soldier, but I just could never picture him as the boss of the family (though I’m not exactly sure why not).

I believe this is the function the storyline will serve in the long run. This quiet, simple episode was merely a setup that showed us where Tony now is both mentally and physically, and in both regards he is becoming more and more exhausted. And as the realization that he has more years as boss behind him than ahead becomes clearer to him, the need to name and train an heir seems all the more urgent. But it is Tony’s own ill-treatment of his own men that will leave him alone and helpless. In this case, it was the need for revenge over a ridiculous fight that could leave Tony and Bobby’s relationship stressed beyond repair, and leaving the options for Tony’s successor even more limited than it already is.

Do you guys think I’m off-base? Could there be a more likely turn Bobby will take as a result of this? What exactly will his emotional response be to taking another man’s life for the first time?

[Universal Polymath]

For the piece of shirt to come back and haunt bobby....there would need to be 2 things:
1. skin or hair on the shirt--> which is almost a certainty
2. bobby would have to have his dna in the fbi database or he would have to be a person of interest who would be subpoenaed into submitting his dna...and chances are the local Canadian police are not gonna search the entire american dna database, cause even a 2 person comparative dna analysis takes 2 weeks ....

and from what i gather from religiously watching the episodes on dvd...bobby hasnt ever been arrested at least from the stories presented on dna....


so i think he is cool

I really don't know about how DNA evidence is used or obtained, but sounds like you make a good point. Interesting, though, is the idea that started this thread. What a twist it would be, that all these mobsters get away with murder over and over, but Bobby gets pinched after his very first one - that he was extremely reluctant to do in the first place! And Tony would ultimately feel responsible for Bobby's downfall, having vindictively ordered him to commit the murder to begin with. That would make for an interesting plot twist, I'm looking forward to seeing how this plays out and what consequences arise as a result of that hit.

[veddertrey]

Me and my brother rewatched the entire series over the past couple of months...and we both kept commenting on how most of the killimgs would be solved by dna evidence....earlier in the show they didnt seem to care at all...

[Joe]

This is the exact type of Sopranos situation that is impossible to predict.

This Bobby-Montreal hit and his subsequent sloppiness could led to his eventual arrest, flipping and may become one of the major plotlines that defines the entire outcome and ending of the show – or it could never be mentioned again outside of its context of how it relates to Bobby’s emotional state.

You really can’t tell. While on the one hand Bobby’s own remark about DNA evidence could be considering pretty obvious foreshadowing, it could also be completely irrelevant. The Sopranos has had some pretty sloppy hits, the most blatant being the Paulie/Vito robbery where they shoot up a bunch of people and leave prints everywhere. Its always been a sort of flaw in the realism of the show.

[Giuseppe Soprano]

I liked Carmella's foreshadowing of this - when Tony is sitting out looking out on the lake the morning after the fight, reminiscing of his impressions on a young Carmella by beating up a locally reknowned tough-guy at 'Pizza World', Carmella exclaims something along the lines of "Should I be impressed you beat up your brother-in-law on your 47th birthday" yet what is interesting, is the line she follows up with:


"You get away with MURDER because you are his (Bobby's) boss"


We all know what Tony later asked of Bobby in order to reaffirm to him, without explicitally having to state it (although an order to kill is rather explicit IMO!) who was still actually in charge even after Bobby's seeming win after getting 'one-up' on Tony in the Monopoly Massacre :)

Did Carmella, perhaps, subliminially plant this order in Tonys mind at this point?
Obviously she had NO idea what was going on with any Canadians etc yet would Tony somehow take some weird reassurance from Carmella's words, ply them around his own inner thought process with regards to what he later asks of Bobby, to perhaps think himself that he is somehow doing the right thing?

With regards to charaters' female partners/associates having their ears on such matters, we have seen this before with Livia and Junior re the Brendan Filone (sp?) - although this was much more specific and calculating yet also we have since similar, in this 'innocent' resepect, in 6A, when Mrs Leotardo told Phil that Vito should be "Made to pay for his actions (his homosexual lifestyle which she saw as a sin owing to her religious beliefs)"

We all know what Phil did next.

[haironmelfistwat]

I wonder if he might have shot Harpo?

If so, I hope Janice gets so distraught that she puts a bullet into her brain. She just ruins the whole series for me.

Laugh my fuking ass way off...

[Detective Hunt]

In the beginning of the episode, Tony makes it clear to Bobby that he feels that he can depend on Christopher less and less. While the heir apparent for several years now, Christopher’s lack of devotion – and diverging interests – have left Tony uncertain that his nephew can effectively carry the family after Tony’s gone. Unfortunately, this realization about Chris couldn’t have come at a worse time for Tony. He feels old and tired, and seems to recognize the end of his tenure as boss approaching rapidly. At a time when he feels the need to solidify someone in the position to take charge of the family, Tony feels that he must turn to someone else. And that someone turns to be his brother-in-law Bobby. His brother-in-law is a loyal, dependable soldier – a man whom Tony decides deserves more responsibility and a chance to step up.

However, the next responsibility Bobby is given is to commit murder, something he has managed to avoid for his entire life. Tony, feeling threatened and bitter about being beaten up by Bobby the night before, vindictively uses Bobby’s pride in never having killed another human being against him. And being the loyal person Bobby is, he commits the deed – despite his extreme desire not to. The act clearly shakes Bobby up. He isn’t a hardened killer like his peers, desensitized to even the most grizzly acts of violence. Bobby is hesitant and timid, as he not only commits an act he never wanted to do himself, but knew his father always wanted him to avoid as well. The episode ends with Bobby reuniting with his family, but through his warm smile, we can see a change in his face. He seems regretful, remorseful, and we see just how quickly one can be sucked into Tony Soprano's world of uncertainty, lament, and evil. And kudos to Steve Schirripa, by the way, as that thoughtful gaze he gives at the end is eerie as hell! Almost as strikingly hard and chilling as Gandolfini’s signature stare.

So what effect will taking another life have on Bobby's psyche now? He has been unquestionably devoted to the life in the past, but never at a time when he was put in such a compromising and psychologically-damaging situation. Will Bobby forever resent Tony for knowingly forcing him to “pop his cherry”? Will he attempt to gradually isolate himself from his boss, in an attempt to isolate himself from the possibility of having to commit such an act again? I can see Bobby – hopelessly rueful and troubled by the killing – begin to try to distance himself from the life. He was comfortable within that world, only as long as he never committed murder, but that is something he can no longer tell himself, which could really destroy him.

What effect will this change have on his new position in Tony’s eyes? Tony will most likely find Bobby too weak to carry on his legacy, and find Bobby as unsuitable for the position as Christopher. Of course, this would be a detrimental blow to Tony; what a terrible thing, to be on the way out without having anyone around him fit to take over. It would leave Tony in an extremely unfavorable position, made worse only by the fact that he will know it was his own actions – motivated by his trivial need for revenge – that brought about that position. Even as he tried to convince himself that Bobby was too weak and unfit, he would still struggle with his own part in his brother-in-law’s downfall. Who would be next in line, if not Christopher or Bobby? Silvio would appear to be next in line, but he discovered last year just how heavy the crown lies, when he proved to be in no way able to deal with the stress of being boss. Paulie? He is a great soldier, but I just could never picture him as the boss of the family (though I’m not exactly sure why not).

I believe this is the function the storyline will serve in the long run. This quiet, simple episode was merely a setup that showed us where Tony now is both mentally and physically, and in both regards he is becoming more and more exhausted. And as the realization that he has more years as boss behind him than ahead becomes clearer to him, the need to name and train an heir seems all the more urgent. But it is Tony’s own ill-treatment of his own men that will leave him alone and helpless. In this case, it was the need for revenge over a ridiculous fight that could leave Tony and Bobby’s relationship stressed beyond repair, and leaving the options for Tony’s successor even more limited than it already is.

Do you guys think I’m off-base? Could there be a more likely turn Bobby will take as a result of this? What exactly will his emotional response be to taking another man’s life for the first time?
Some interesting views there. I defintely think Tony is considering Bobby for potentially replacing Chris if needed down the road, and I have to wonder if perhaps now more than ever after he feels a certain sense of new-found respect for Bobby underneath all the shame and frustration. The kill for Bobby was as much to tie him to Tony (much as he did with Chris) as it is making Bobby do something he doesn't want to do as a way to get back at him.

As for Bobby, I am surprised really, that he has made it as far as he has in the mafia without a hit. If he is going to get higher up, then he needs to command respect. It appears he might be doing a little of that now. And do not discount Janice's role - I think we all know she want's Bobby to keep rising in the ranks. Were the opportunity open, she would love to be the Boss's wife. And with the way things seem to be moving between Tony and Chris, there is a void to be filled. I would have to admit, however, I would have never picked Bobby before. Who knows...maybe he's a changed man this time around.

[Splishak]

What exactly will his emotional response be to taking another man’s life for the first time?

Well, DC could make these characters behave in any way he wants. But, assuming that the characters are somewhat realistic, I can't imagine Bobby going all to pieces after killing someone. He didn't seem to have much trouble going through with the actual act, did he? And we've seen Bobby do all kinds of threating and mob-like behavior in the past. Also, he loved his dad so much and his dad killed many many people and Bobby didn't ever seem to have any problem with that.

So, all in all, I don't think it's very realistic to expect Bobby to have any major problems carrying on.

If, however, he can't handle it, I would hope that the least he can do is to take out Janice on the way out.

I'm sorry to harp on this point. Many of you have probably seen that I strongly dislike the actress and really hate the character she plays. I see that many of you disapprove of these attitudes since you feel that AT is a very fine actress.

Well, I'll try to cool it and keep my negative opinions to myself. It's not that I'm afraid of expressing those attitudes. But I think that having expressed them a few times, it's probably just annoying to keep harping on it. So, thank you all for putting up with me and I'll try to wait until I have something actually factual or interesting to say before repeating my feelings about her again.

[Universal Polymath]

I agree Bobby's been exposed to murder and death his whole life, but I'm just assuming it's one thing to see others kill and another to do it yourself. Early in the series, the characters discuss the significance their first has on them, in an attempt to comfort Christopher's worries about killing Emil Kolar. True, Chris got over that really quick, but everybody's different. Bobby has always struck me as a little 'softer' and more considerate than the other hardened criminals in their "social club". I don't know, maybe other people don't see Bobby in this way, but I've always liked him and saw him in a different light than the others in his circle.

Even if he's not emotionally broken, I think his response could be of anger and resentment towards Tony. Bobby, like Christopher, could begin to worry about getting caught for the murder, and he would undoubtedly blame Tony for his anxiety. I don't think Bobby would have time to blame himself for his own actions, that's not how these mobsters think. When the boss says "jump", they jump - Bobby feeling as though he had a choice in this matter is nonexistent. He'll blame Tony for ordering the hit more than he'd ever blame himself for actually committing it, and I can see this putting a strain on their relationship, at least for the time.

If, however, he can't handle it, I would hope that the least he can do is to take out Janice on the way out.

Hey, no need to apologize, and I found the way you put this quite funny! I'm not a huge fan of Janice either, and last night's episode reminded me why I didn't quite a few times.

[Splishak]

Bobby has always struck me as a little 'softer' and more considerate than the other hardened criminals in their "social club".

True dat. And, in addition, he also seemed to have this little "peculiar streak". I don't know how that might play out. But I have a hunch it may play out before the series ends.

You never can tell. But if any one of these guys decide to become "born again" and confess their sins as well as everybody else's sins, I would guess that jest might be little Bobby! Heh. Heh. Heh.

Say, Universal Polymath? Are you any relation to Proimagemaker? For some reason, your names just seem to sould awfully similar.

[Splishak]

Say, Universal Polymath? Are you any relation to Proimagemaker? For some reason, your names just seem to sould awfully similar.

[chaseisgod]

Well, DC could make these characters behave in any way he wants. But, assuming that the characters are somewhat realistic, I can't imagine Bobby going all to pieces after killing someone. He didn't seem to have much trouble going through with the actual act, did he? And we've seen Bobby do all kinds of threating and mob-like behavior in the past. Also, he loved his dad so much and his dad killed many many people and Bobby didn't ever seem to have any problem with that.

So, all in all, I don't think it's very realistic to expect Bobby to have any major problems carrying on.

If, however, he can't handle it, I would hope that the least he can do is to take out Janice on the way out.

I'm sorry to harp on this point. Many of you have probably seen that I strongly dislike the actress and really hate the character she plays. I see that many of you disapprove of these attitudes since you feel that AT is a very fine actress.

Well, I'll try to cool it and keep my negative opinions to myself. It's not that I'm afraid of expressing those attitudes. But I think that having expressed them a few times, it's probably just annoying to keep harping on it. So, thank you all for putting up with me and I'll try to wait until I have something actually factual or interesting to say before repeating my feelings about her again.

Just remember -- she's SUPPOSED to be annoying. It helps us relate to the main characters. She doesn't just push their buttons, she pushes ours, too.

[TommySoprano]

In regards to the hit that Bobby carried out and his mention of DNA earlier in the episode. I was wondering does anybody think he could have been wearing one of Tony's shirts when he did the hit and the Canadien ripped a piece of it off? Wasn't it Bobby that brought Tony and Carm's bags to Tonys truck when they were leaving? He could have lifted one before he brought the bags down.

[chaseisgod]

The writers have certainly been dropping hints that DNA evidence may play a role down the line. Last year, when Syl and the other guy killed Fat Dom, Syl said he didn't want him chopped up because of potential to leave behind DNA evidence.

[Splishak]

I think there could possibly be a situation with the guy ripping the piece of bobbys shirt off with dna evidence

Remember last season how some of thought there might well be a situation with Tony and Chris ripping off the "Vipers"? This feels awful similar to that. Heh! Maybe the guy who ripped the shirt was a Viper? Hah! Hah!

[Universal Polymath]

Say, Universal Polymath? Are you any relation to Proimagemaker? For some reason, your names just seem to sould awfully similar.

Nope, no relation at all!

[BellaConsigliere]

I haven't made up my mind one way or the other regarding Bobby's first hit. I think that we saw yet another level of Tony's manipulativeness...he realized he couldn't physically whip Bobby, so he decided to pierce his armor at the most vulnerable point. But, at the same time, it seems unlikely that Tony would hand over the reins to someone that's never even killed anyone, so perhaps making Bobby do a hit was inevitable. If you can't kill someone in this line of business, how on earth could you stand up to the pressure of being boss? We saw the toll it took on Sil, and he seemed like the most capable of the crew. Or look at Phil Leotardo--massive heart attack. It is a stressful position that takes a calm, intelligent and cunning person. I have my doubts about Bobby or Chris ever becoming what Tony is looking for.

I'm curious what Chase will do with this plotline. Chances are he will drop it, like other intriguing plots (where is the Russian?? lol) and just leave it for us to wonder about. But the gun in the snow, the hollow point bullets warning, the DNA warning and Bobby's sloppy hit are all pretty heavy foreshadowing. We'll see...

[gistenhose]

I don't know if this belongs in this post or not, but I keep coming back to the impact of fathers & sons on this series. Melfi always tried to get Tony to see his dad for what he was...a brutal thug, who got Tony into OC.

Tony doesn't want it for AJ; Bobby's dad didn't want it for Bobby; etc. The father's never got their way.

This shooting represents Bobby going against his dad's wishes. I think it's a harbinger for AJ getting into OC.

Also the bullet to the beehive highlighted Johnny as the animal he was. Tony couldn't deal w/ the story being told. He didn't want the family to seem dysfunctional. Funny, but sad cause a Monopoly fight is pretty dysfunctional.

Junior has been Tony's surrogate dad. He tried to kill Tony (twice). Tony was in real denial. Bobby was Junior's caregiver, yet he wasn't there to get shot.

He cannot come to grips with the fact that this is the life his dad got him into. That is fake dad shot him. It's always been about Olivia for Tony. Cause he cannot deal with his father.

In essense he is the 'father' of this crew. Even though Bobby's real father didn't want this life for Bobby, Tonydad made sure it happened.

It's so sick and so sad and so fascinating.

[Al Sikeli]

A lot of nice ideas here. I think the shirt tearing is important only for what it could mean - the whole episode is about foreshadowing. For instance, they talk about the child drowning while everyone is sitting around a pool drinking, then AJ has people over at the house. It foreshadow's Bianca's daughter doing the same, but like a lot of Sopranos twists, this one never happens. Bobby in the boat talks about DNA evidence, and then leaves it himself. But the greater imagery there is about how Bobby has taken the final step into the deepest sh!t. He whacked the kid and is now a murderer, damned, no way back. And when he comes back to his lake house he grabs his daughter, and sees Janice - already a murderess - hosting to faceless guests. He has defiled his father's "sanctuary." It will always be dark and ruined. His only concern is now his child, who he realizes he has exposed to something horrible through himself and marrying Janice.

Bobby also is the son of the "terminator" who Bobby said always would have preferred to cut hair. The foreshadowing is that Bobby would have preferred never to dive all the way in, but he has, and he can be brutal and evil - more than Tony whom he beat - and he could be the Don. He is more sensitve and child like, but he also can be a monster. Now he is going to become one.

I wouldn't be surprised if Bobby kills Janice to thwart her influence on his kids.

[Krakower Thing]

In the real world, people connected to the estranged wife of the laundromat victim would be the first people to fall under suspicion. And the trail to Tony and Bobby would not be very hard to uncover.

Now, this is not the real world but The Sopranos where either artistic license is taken and no murder gets looked into, or more likely we presume investigations that get no traction and don't bring any heat on the Family do not merit screen time.

However, there are some hints that this case might potentially be different as cited elsewhere on this board:
-the mention by Sil of DNA evidence in "Cold Stones" echoed by Bobby earlier in this episode.
-the whole focus on Bobby's "virginity" coupled with the discussion that it only ends up either in jail or the morgue.
-beginning the whole season (or season part- annoying) with a thrown gun that leads to an arrest
-Janice telling Bobby to throw away any hollow point bullets
-Bobby giving Tony a gun and his talking about not hunting with a gun
-Carmela "You get away with murder because you're his boss."
(After all, by ordering the murder, Tony is legally on the line too.)
-and of course the very noticeable ripping of his shirt

It definitiely would be David Chase-like to misdirect us to think something will happen and then have the risk to a character subside.

But I think this is different for some reason. It very much recalls Eugene being "forced" to do a hit he didn't want to and then paying the Karma cost soon thereafter. Someone else somewhere wrote about Karma on the show and I think it's definitiely there. Don't forget Vito killed the innocent guy getting his mail on his drive back to New Jersey where he himself would soon be killed. I think Bobby is in deep shit with the Universe now in one way or another.

Most of all, we can safely assume every pressure around Tony is going to build and build to extreme levels over the next two months and they've already shown us legal pressure will be primary among them. I personally think the only debate is will the laundromat murder feed that directly or only indirectly.

[dannyc7684]

First off that was a great scene, the emotion that he portrayed during and after the kill was amazing, I could almost feel his pain in the end when he was holding his daughter looking out at the water.

But in relation to the show I feel that there could be a possibility that this gets back to Bobby. When the cops showed up on the scene they were going to find both a torn off piece of clothing as well as the murder weapon. Either way you look at it this was a murder and it will be investigated, it may not immeadiately get back to Bobby, but if there canadian contact has a record and the murder somehow gets linked to him than he may give up Bobby to save his own butt. In that case it would be as simple as matching finger prints from the gun or dna from the shirt.

[tomahawk]

In that case it would be as simple as matching finger prints from the gun or dna from the shirt.

Bobby wore gloves (I watched this closely to confirm this.). He also used an untracable weapon since the plan was to just drop the gun and leave. They might get lucky and get a DNA sample, but since Bobby isn't an obvious suspect and he hasn't been arrested before, its doubtful the DNA will turn up in a search.

The only way he gets pinched is if one of the Canucks sing or if he was was seen and ID'ed by the girl leaving the laundry (not likely).

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

The posts that went on a tangent about AJ were moved to this thread http://thechaselounge.net/showthread.php?t=1456 dealing with AJ and Blanca.

[2drama]

Kinda felt a little sad for Bobby....I think he regretted it? But he did it to prove his loyalty.

Great song at the end....fitted perfectly.

bobby is a made man , i am sure he commited murder before in his role in the soprano family

remember when he shot the rapper (lol) bobbi

[tomahawk]

bobby is a made man , i am sure he commited murder before in his role in the soprano family

remember when he shot the rapper (lol) bobbi

Since both Tony and Bobby confirm this, how can you question this fact?

I did think it was funny when Bobby was trying to convince the rapper to let him shoot him by saying "I'm a marksman".

[Vinny Vincenzo]

I wonder if he might have shot Harpo?

If so, I hope Janice gets so distraught that she puts a bullet into her brain. She just ruins the whole series for me.

That angle is intriguing. When meeting with the Canadians, Bobby said something that I believe was meant to be a clue or one of Chase's wild goose chases. He said something to the effect, "Take a child from his mother? What kind of a person could do that?". I think the answer is, a person who's mother abandoned them, i.e. Janice's child Harpo (Hal).

My questions are:

In Janice's biography on HBO, they say she married a French-Canadian named Eugene. Why is his last never never mentioned?

In Season 5, Episode 62 "Cold Cuts", Tony taunts Janice with the remark, "What's French-Canadian for 'I grew up without a mother?". Was that remark planted for a later purpose?

In Soprano Home Movies credits, they list the name of the kid Bobby shot as "Rene LeCours", played by Marc Bonan. Why did they bother to list his first and last name? Why not "the kid Bobby shot. Nobody mentioned his name during the show.

The kid Marc Bonan who played Rene LeCours. He looks Italian, no? (Although his father was an Egyptian Jew and his Mother was Romanian.) He could pass for an offspring of one of the Turturros. And they spent a lot of time teasing out his hair so it looked frizzy during a very long close up of him. Was that so everybody could see a family resemblance in him? Why this kid? My father's family was from Quebec and none of them look like this kid. Very a-typical French Canadian.

In the Soprano Family tree in Answers Please, they have Harpo as being born in 1982, so he'd be approx. 25 years old. This Bonan kid is 27. Close enough?

Marc Bonan (http://wave.prohosting.com/patan/pictures/Bonan%20passport%20Marc.jpg)

[Universal Polymath]

If it turns out that it was Harpo that Bobby killed, I will eat my hat.

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

That angle is intriguing. When meeting with the Canadians, Bobby said something that I believe was meant to be a clue or one of Chase's wild goose chases. He said something to the effect, "Take a child from his mother? What kind of a person could do that?". I think the answer is, a person who's mother abandoned them, i.e. Janice's child Harpo (Hal).

I think this is just Chase's mischeivous side. I've heard that he's found some of the most elaborate, far-reaching analyses put forth by fans quite amusing. I feel the coincidence of making this guy a French Canadian, about Harpo's age, and embroiled in a custody battle to take a kid from his mother is Chase baiting a hook to see if he can get anyone to bite. To me it appears a deliberate coincidence but only to serve as an inside joke.

We're talking something along the lines of coincidental DNA match probabilities for this kid to be Harpo, and that kind of improbability is far too much of a contrivance to be Chase's style. He's already done one episode that featured improbable coincidences that led nowhere -- when Meadow met Saskia Kupferberg and Elliot came across Tony in the parking garage of Columbia. I think that's as improbable as he's willing to go.:icon_wink:

[WhistlingInTheWheatfield]

I don't think the outcome of Bobby's first kill will result in trouble with the Feds. I think a more interesting scenario is seeing how it changes Bobby for the long term. Also how he views Tony who put it on him to do it. Tony saw Bobby as one of those "happy wonderers" that he talks about, and essentially took away any innocence he had left.

[Johny Foulmouth]

I think that part with the shirt getting ripped off was ridicilous, I have never seen a shirt or whatever just rip like that, maybe in a fight.. but a guy that just took one to the chest being strong enough to just rip a shirt like that, that's shit was made of paper or what?

[billyp]

I skimmed through without reading every post, but I think Bobby is safe from any DNA findings. Even if they have his DNA...

#1. It happened in Canada. How likely is it that an investigation will lead them to Bobby in New Jersey.

#2. Bobby hasn't killed before so what do they have to cross reference the DNA evidence with?

I'm not aware of any criminal record on Bobby's part. (If I'm wrong, tell me). Maybe if he gets pinched for something in the future, he would have a bigger chance of this catching up with him, but for now, IMO, I would say he is safe.

[Splishak]

People in Canada are just as aware that New Jersey is only a short distance away from Montreal (much shorter than it is to Chiboutami, for example) than people in New Jersey are aware that Montreal is only a short distance away from them. It's a small world and getting smaller all da time.

Murder isn't the only crime for which they cross-reference the DNA. I bet they would check DNA for many other crimes - not just murder.

[billyp]

Murder isn't the only crime for which they cross-reference the DNA. I bet they would check DNA for many other crimes - not just murder.

That's why I asked if Bobby has any record. I don't think anything has ever been mentioned.