Rat Pack ~ Review

[Rightfielder21]

What did everyone think?

</p>

[Rightfielder21]

It is obvious that the first two episodes were set ups for the rest of the season. The season premire, set up Tony's personal life ~ Carmela and Melfi. The second episode set up his business life, NY Power Struggle and Family Rats...

Next week we should start getting into story lines...

</p>

[bushleaguer1]

I agree - definitely was a setup for the season in regards to Tony's business life.
I thought the stuff with Tony's cousin was great. He's a wiseass who is going to be rubbing people (no pun intended) the wrong way. It was priceless seeing Tony's reaction when he walked in on the massage session.
I also thought it was really intriguing how Adriana ratted out the woman who was flirting with Christopher.

Line of the night was by Ro - "Apostle Protection Program"

</p>

[harmony2k66]

Another great episode. I loved the entire thing. I thought that a drunken Tony, trying to position the painting was perfect. His late night call to Blundetto was funny, as was Ade's way of handling "the competition". I thought that the scene of Feech handling Blundetto the envelope, with Tony watching from a distance, was perfect. Another A+

</p>

[Rightfielder21]

I wouldn't give it an A+, I thought it was good, but honestly, not much happened, it was a set-up episode... I would give it a ~ B...

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub132.ezboard.com/bsopranolandforum.showUserPublicProfile?gid=rightf ielder21>Rightfielder21</A> at: 3/15/04 7:00 am

[cinwagon3]

i think this episode is putting a start of the puzzle pieces together. I give it a A+. It mkes me want to keep coming back for more.

</p>

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

Nowhere near the top-notch opener. I'm aware, of course, that as an ep geared almost entirely toward new story and new character exposition (and the fed investigation) it was bound to lack depth. But it's almost unheard of for a Sops ep to lack any real humor or other "got you" moment, even amid such ministerial if necessary story chores.

A lot of the dullness could be laid at the feet of the script writer for this ep, since those kinds of sparkling details and textures would ostensibly be provided at the script level rather than the outline level that Chase crafts for the whole season arc. I mean, the film club thing could have been funny. The idea was decent. But the execution was ordinary, if not poor, making it a spectacular failure by this show's standards. This was, IIRC, a new writer, and one (based on this ep) I hope not to hear from again.

I'm reserving judgment on Tony B because it's early and I think he may provide great story potential down the line. I also am trying hard to overcome my objection to the introduction at this late stage of a character who we are to believe is and was very important to Tony -- like a brother to him -- yet someone whose existence was never even casually mentioned until season 5, ep 1. I would have much preferred that Tony B have been brought on as a cousin who Tony knew and befriended as a kid but lost contact with in teen or early adult years for reasons unrelated to prison, because that would make omission of his name onscreen for 4 years much more believable.

All that aside, I was hardly bowled over, either by Buscemi or the character himself. I expected someone a little more cerebral and reflective, in a jaded sort of way, based on Chase's and Buscemi's comments. Again, the failure of any scene to really elicit something memorable and affecting from this character in his first big splash onscreen could substantially be the fault of an inferior script writer for this ep.

On the good side, my favorite scene of the night was the toast Tony S made at Vesuvio, complete with Gandolfini's amusing impersonation of Nancy Marchand as Livia. I also like the factual exposition that Tony B apparently took the rap for something that Tony S could have gone down for, thus TS' emotional reaction to the Band of Brothers documentary. I like the fact that Tony B is trying to go straight and that Tony S is already apparently resentful or jealous of his courage to try it. And I also was very intrigued by the stuff involving Tony B's missing daughter. All those provide ripe soil for future harvests.



</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub132.ezboard.com/bsopranolandforum.showUserPublicProfile?gid=flyonm elfiswall>FlyOnMelfisWall</A> at: 3/15/04 1:48 am

[chicoxl]

Decent episode. Not earth shattering, but not without a place. It defintely acted as a set-up for future action, that's for sure.

I don't like the introduction of Blundetto myself. I think FoMW is right on with introducing him so late in the game. For 4 years, nobody mentioned his name, and now he's a long-long hero?

The stuff with the Feds was great, though, and it's surely going to get clearer as we go on...

</p>

[harmony2k66]

As soon as I watched the opening credits I cringed a little when I saw the writers name and realized I had never seen it before. On the other hand, I really enjoyed this episode. It felt fresh to me. Granted, a lot of it was plot development for the rest of the season, but I thought there was a lot of humor to be had.
-Mazaraone and Tony talking about "mothers".
-Blundetto fixing Vito's back, and Tony's expression.
-Interaction between Blundetto and Baccala's son.
-Tony looking in the mirror and realizing he hadn't lost any weight.
-Tony trying to arrange the "Ratpack" painting.
-Ade's decision to get rid of her bride's maid.
I thought that the episode was really good. I liked it just as much as "Two Tonys". It was good to have the Curto angle back in the saddle, to hear more about Zellman (might be a misspeling). To hear that wire tap from "All Debts" was nice.
I thought that Drea De Matteo's acting was the best it has ever been.
And of course, cheap skate Curto was nice.
Did anyone else notice Danielle, with her new hair? I also just caught that line about Ade still lying as far as Paulie being at the crazy horse.

</p>

[harmony2k66]

I thought that Tony was getting misty because he thought of Junior, or if nothing else, the older generation (Carmine).

</p>

[harmony2k66]

I thought tha Frank Vincent (Phillip Leotardo)'s joke about Jesus was pretty funny.
I loved the entire argument between Johnny Sack and Carmine Junior. The medallion was priceless.
"Just last week you said I was like a son to him"
"He was on his deathbed"
"I should have written it down".
I thought all that was pretty funny, even though it was just setting up there respective feud. And then Tony, "body's not even cold yet".

</p>

[harmony2k66]

Another thing I didn't notice, was Tony, Carmella, AJ, and Meadow, trying to act like a family around Blundetto. All the tension was great. Especially when AJ and Meadow left, and then Carm and Tony stood alone, neither having anything to say to the other.

It's almost like the writers gave there opinion on Blundetto's sudden appearance through Bobby Jr.
"How come we've never heard of you" Or something along those lines. Blundetto just sits there, and no one has an answer.


</p>

[harmony2k66]

I loved Th Ladies cringning when the next film would be The Godfather. I found a lot of humor in the Tony talking about his "feeling him out" skills, and then the
"What am, I f****** mind reader"?


</p>

[PIZZALAND]

Does anyone think the first two episodes are moving rather quickly? Not in a time sense of us watching it because that always goes fast! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> But rather that the episodes are moving really fast from scene to scene. I don't remember any of the other episodes from any of the other seasons moving this quickly.

</p>

[eruptus]

Just watched it... All in all it was a solid episode, but definitely a set up episode. The introduction of Tony B was a little strange, because we hadn't heard anything about this guy and now he's like a brother to Tony. I really liked all the stuff about his daughter and the parallels between him and Tony S. Meadow is probably the same age as Tony B's daughter and she is in university, it probably wouldn't be that way if Tony S had been in jail for 15 years. Tony B has a reason to be a little bitter towards Tony. On the other hand, Tony S is a little jealous to him, because he has the opportunity to leave the mob-life for good.

Junior had too little screentime again, but he was great. His "crack the whip" -speech was really emotional, and the way they cut that scene to Carmine's funeral was superb. I smell an Emmy for Dominic Chianese this year, I really wish that Junior had more screentime this year.

</p>

[moth78]

Wow... haven't seen a group of fans with such high expectations of a piece of popular culture since the Phantom Menace.

Jack Masserone's corpse hasn't even cooled and people are ripping apart the show, the writer, Buscemi's character. Personally, I think this was a great episode for all the right reasons. We had confrontation between Tony and Carmela, introduction of what could be a very cool character in Tony B, a lot of exposition that in my opinion was handled very efficiently and moved swiftly without getting boring, and two deaths of supporting characters, one a pivotal plot point for the season (Carmine), the other a completely unexpected development (Masserone). The show surprised me once again, and that's why I love it.

I think that sometimes as fans, especially as fans who've been bathing in spoilers for months and months, we expect too much. Try to watch the show from the point of view of someone who doesn't know what's going to happen. I always watch the show with a group of friends, none of whom look at these message boards, and it's always refreshing to see just how surprised, entertained and captivated they become with each development.

You cringe because you see an unfamiliar writer's name in the opening credits? IMHO, that sounds rather jaded. What, are only a select handful of writers able to write for this show? I also pay attention to who writes what, being a writer myself, but when I see a name I don't know working on a show of this caliber, it excites me. Here's someone who could have some new ideas and take the show in a fresh direction.

I understand being a huge fan and the weird love/hate relationship you build with any new developments on a show like this... but we've got 11 episodes left. Just let them happen and enjoy it while it's here.

</p>

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

Moth, it seems like at least part of your pep talk is aimed at me, specifically at telling me how I should react to the show. So let me correct some misimpressions on your part.

(1) I am not "ripping apart the show", by which I'm talking about the series as a whole. I am not one of these Sopranos "declinists" who equate the quality of an episode with the amount of bloodshed during the hour or the number of topless dancers given chest closeups. Quite the opposite, in fact. I simply found this episode to be well below the quality, structurally and on the script-writing level, of last week's outstanding episode, which I felt was absolutely the best season opener since the pilot and which understandably had me anxiously awaiting ep 2.

(2) And about my expectations. Of course they are high. I regard the Sopranos as the greatest television series of all time and easily one of the greatest artistic accomplishments ever on film. There have only been about 5 episodes in the 4 plus seasons that disappointed me, and this is one of them. That averages to one per season, so hopefully this is the weak episode of season 5, out of the way early.

(3) I haven't been "bathing in spoilers". As a matter of fact, I've gone to great lengths to avoid them because I WANT to see everything with no preconceptions and as a matter of absolute first impression.

(4) I wasn?t at all ?cringing? when the opening credits rolled (and I know you were directing those remarks primarily to another poster). I was quite willing to give this new writer a chance to prove himself, but he simply impressed me in all the wrong ways. Examples:

-- Maserone remarks, out of the blue, that he only wishes his mother could have lived to see him make his speech. Tony's perfunctory response then elicits a complete 180 from Maserone in both word and demeanor, to the effect that he knows where she is and that "it's pretty f---ing hot".

This was simply an unnatural and idiotically rapid progression from one idea to a totally contradictory idea. If the scene was just insignificant small talk, then it was blatantly bad writing.

OTOH, if it's purpose was to show Maserone trying to forge some kind of personal rapport out of shared experiences with Tony to gain greater trust, I could think of about 10 better ways in 10 minutes to have had Maserone do the same thing, ways that would have been much less clunky and awkward and that would have at least afforded Maserone a modicum of outward credibility.

Contrast this with the similar scene from season 4 where Tony tries to elicit from Ralph whether his mother ever abused him, given a segue from Ralph's offhand quote of an aphorism he learned from his mom. Night and day in terms of the realism and credibility of the exchange and from how one thought or remark led seamlessly to the next.

I suppose you could argue that the Maserone exchange was intentionally awkward and that we are to take from that that Maserone was nervous and uncomfortable and Tony too insensitive to pick up on it. But I contend there's no need for the point of the dialog to be THAT unclear. The writer has to help the audience a little . . . not spoon feed but at least provide a fork and knife so we can do our own cutting and chewing.

-- the whole Citizen Kane sequence was a snoozer. Yes, I know the women were really bored by the movie (and I couldn't blame them, there) and it was only Carm's charming artsy pretension that got them all there in the first place. But in the hands of Terrence Winter or Robin Green/Mitch Burgess or some of the other fine freelance writers the show has used through the years (e.g., Lawrence Konner) or Chase himself, I suspect that scene would have really been hilarious. Instead we get the forced, sitcom level joke from Janice that Bobby hadn't found her "rosebud" after six months marriage.

-- the second, aborted movie night was even worse, with such exchanges as ?I guess you guys are all just really important to me?, which prompts an equally eye-rolling lump of saccharine from Silvio?s wife, ?you?d do the same for us Carm? and Janice?s ?we love you so much?. The problem with these exchanges is that they were apparently intended to be taken seriously, yet the emotional setup was so poor that the actors were clearly unable to really sell it.

-- the worst moment last night IMO was when the female FBI agent suddenly decided to indulge Ade?s need for a little bonding and related her marital woes and later her reason for becoming an agent.

Again, what was the intent of the story about the paraplegic sister? It?s just impossible to tell. On it?s face, it was an earnest tale of tragedy that ostensibly explains why this agent would pursue an FBI career. But on closer examination, a guy stealing a TV, buying guns, and splitting a coconut with one of them, resulting in an accidental discharge that left a girl a paraplegic, is hardly top ten most wanted behavior and actually makes the agent?s stated motives sound comical. Yet she?s apparently quite serious.

So was she serious and was this personal tale really supposed to inspire understanding of her motives as an agent? Was she making it up and floundering with a half-assed justification? Was she serious about the FBI being the clearest place you could separate good guys from bad, because she sure sounded serious? Was that the whole point of the scene . . . to leave the viewer totally confused as to her honesty, even with herself, thus ?unable? to tell the good guys from the bad guys?

I just don?t think [leaving the viewer confused] was the point, which again is the fault of the writer. I don?t regard myself as requiring hand-holding to understand subtext or subtlety, so if I don?t get it even after several viewings, I feel it?s a failure by the one communicating, not the one listening.

In short, I just don?t feel this writer provided much of anything memorable to the episode, other than a couple of decent one-liners (?the apostle protection program?). I liked Tony?s speech at Vesuvio, but probably more for Gandolfini?s outstanding acting than anything in the script itself. And I also don?t think Tony B was given the kind of striking introduction that he would seem to rate based on what Chase described the character to be. And I don?t AT ALL mean something relating to striking physical action. I was looking for a real glimpse inside the guy that would crystallize at the outset the marked difference from the Tony crew that this character is supposed to represent.

I also was not pleased with the shotgun-style -- lots-of-short-scenes -- approach of the episode, although editing probably had a small influence on that.

So I hope that you better appreciate the reasons for my criticisms. I don?t expect you or anyone else to necessarily agree with them. But on the other hand, I don?t really need to be told (somewhat sarcastically) how to watch the show or that my expectations are too high.


</p>

[ArtVandalay]

The editing of this episode was cut to "tight". Delete
dialogue and allow only soundtrack and this piece of
film passes for a music video. As others have mentioned,
this one was a throw away. Sacrificied at the alter of Plot
Development.
In no way am I an expert in film or film making. However,
Would flashback scenes have not worked nicely to introduce
Feech, Tony B. to the viewer?
If a bear had been seen in my backyard twice. I would bet
dollars to doughnuts that no member of my family would be
out there in the evening( smoking) till the bear was caught.
( Ro and Aid ).


Regards,
Art

</p>

[TWO GUNS GIANCARLO]

I'm very ambivalent concerning this episode of the Sopranos. The writing was uneven and the pacing was to slow. I did thoroughly enjoy the background information concerning Tony Blundetto and a crime that Tony could have gone to jail for. I know that this episode was just to move the story forward but I am disappointed that it could not have been done in a way more befitting of a Soprano's episode. evil

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub132.ezboard.com/bsopranolandforum.showUserPublicProfile?gid=twogun sgiancarlo>TWO GUNS GIANCARLO</A> http://www.sopranpland.com/images/cigarcrew2t.jpg at: 3/15/04 6:10 pm

[PIZZALAND]

I'm glad Fly said it because I couldn't quite put words with it but she said that the episode was "shotgun style" and I completely agree.

I love the Sopranos so I'm dreadfully reluctant to say that the episode was disappointing so I won't, but the episode seemed to move really fast from scene to scene.

One thing I will say that is getting sort of on my nerves is the women in the show. Here they all are, Carmella, Janice, Gabby, Rose, Ade, and they are all there and none of them seemingly are on to Carmella about getting rid of Tony. Even Rose tells Ade about the whole "Apostle Protection Program" and how they wouldn't want Sal's former wife their because Sal flipped, but what would they say if Carmella all of a sudden started dating a guy not connecting and divorced herself even further and further away from Tony?

To me it just doesn't make sense. I know that Chase said in his commentary on "WHITECAPS" that there really was a mob wife who wanted a divorce but the mafioso wouldn't give it to her, but this is totally different.

The blaring contradiction is that Tony was absolutely right when he said, "Carmella, who did you think I was when you married me?"

I just can't get over it because Carmella did know which is something else Chase said in his "WHITECAPS" commentary.

Carmella and Tony are old-school and I think Carmella knew exactly what she was doing. She made her bed and now she should have to lie in it. Plain and simple.

I'm rooting for Carm and Tony to get back together, but the irony just seemed to miss Carmella when at the end of "WHITECAPS" she called tony a fucking hypocrite yet that is what she's being in wanting to get rid of Tony.

Who knows? Back to the point though. I just don't understand the relationships of the other mob wives and Carmella. Carmella is an outsider to some degree now wanting "OUT" so why would they see her as still an equal?

</p>

[sapori]

Can someone pls tell me -- how exactly did Tony find out that MAssarone was a rat ?? Was the painting bugged ? what was the clue from 'fat comment' ??

</p>

[Rightfielder21]

After he complimented him on losing weight...

</p>

[MikeyL]

Fly, I always enjoy reading your thoughtful and insightful posts!!
About your previous post. You mentioned that you've been disappointed by 4 or 5 episodes. I would be curious to know which ones you were disappointed by???
Also, I only saw this episode once, but couldn't it be possible that Masserone said he wished his mother was alive to hear his speech, to prove her wrong? Possibly as a child or young man she said things like "you'll never make anything of yourself" or "you'll be a failure" That could explain why he says he wishes she could be there, and in the next breath says she is probably in hell.

</p>

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

Hi MikeyL. Thanks for your kind words.

Your proposition about the meaning of Maserone's wish occurred to me, but the line wasn't at all delivered as if that were the intent. He said it with a wistful, nostalgic note in his voice, IMO, that conveyed he wished his mother could have seen it to have shared in his pride and sense of achievements. It was very similar to the many times IRL that I've heard someone lament a parent or loved one didn't live to see some big break or achievement because the deceased would have been so proud.

Mind you, I know that this wasn't really an important point of the show, whatever the intent. But in attempting to illustrate with a few concrete examples why I felt the script was subpar, this scene jumped out at me.

I should state or reiterate that "disappointment" is always a relative proposition in critiquing the consistent brilliance of the Sopranos. But the episodes that have stuck out to me as being markedly weaker (for different reasons) than all others are:

"Nobody Knows Anything"

Obviously it was very important to the narrative as it proffered pretty solid evidence that Pussy and/or Jimmy Altieri were traitors. But I felt the "it was f---ing Jimmy"s went on too long, and the episode lacked the Soprano family dynamic and Melfi-steered investigations of Tony's psychological landscape that made this series, especially in that first season, so great.

"D Girl"

I thought the whole scenario of illiterate, uncerebral, unreflective AJ suddenly spouting "Niche" to be a tad far-fetched, notwithstanding his impending confirmation. And the dialog was equally contrived in trying to communicate his sudden philosophical explorations.

Moreover, I have ZERO interest in Chris apart from what he means to Tony's story. He, like Paulie and even Silvio, doesn't have the moral complexity to make me really care what happens to him nor does the character have the intelligence or charisma to carry an episode on his own. I suppose there were a few cheap laughs in his delusional flirtation with moviemaking, but mostly it just felt forced and predictable.

The episode was salvaged near the end with Pussy's speech to AJ and the FBI listening to him cry in the bathroom over the wire.

"Mr. Ruggierio's Neighborhood"

There was nothing wrong with the direction on this episode -- i.e., the way the substance was filmed and executed. In fact, from that standpoint, it was very good. The problem was that the script consisted almost entirely of a ministerial presentation of facts and plot details, all revolving around the minutiae of FBI efforts to bug the Soprano home, with no real involvment of character. It is singular in that respect among Sopranos episodes. Everything important that was shown over the course of that hour could have been condensed into about 10-15 minutes, tops, and the rest of the ep could have been devoted to the "little" scenes between the Soprano family and crew or used for some other self-contained, single ep development (e.g., Tony and Carm moving Meadow's belongings to her new dorm at Columbia, Tony complaining about how much she was taking, Carm getting a bit misty at the thought of her eldest child finally leaving home, etc.,). I would much have preferred to see that than all those excrutiating details of painting a matching lamp and following every family member all over town while multiple FBI efforts to plant the lamp were made.

I remain convinced that someone at HBO must have felt similarly, because they premiered eps 1 and 2 of season 3 back-to-back, the only time that's been done. Thankfully, we got the astoundingly brilliant and darkly hilarious "Proshai, Livushka" in that second hour.

"Pie O' My"

Another big exposition episode that I don't like because it didn't contain enough interesting character stuff. I think it was better than any of the other three eps previously mentioned, but it just didn't do much for me.

I would put "Rat Pack" about on that level.

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub132.ezboard.com/bsopranolandforum.showUserPublicProfile?gid=flyonm elfiswall>FlyOnMelfisWall</A> at: 3/15/04 9:30 pm

[ArtVandalay]

I believe that the hit was decided when Tony stared into
the mirror and with body language showed the camera his
character's disgust with his weight.
Tony knew that that comment about him recently losing weight was BS.

Regards,
Art

</p>

[harmony2k66]

I didn't care for "Nobody Knows Anything". I never understood all the hype for "D-Girl", I found it to be a very over rated episode. I enjoyed Pie-O-My, and I thought if they hadn't aired the second episode after Mr. Ruggerio's Neighborhood For Season Three, there would have been a riot!
I think I read your post that Season Two was your least favioirite as well. I completly agree with you. I love the show, but Season Two was my least faviorite. I don't know, Ive watched and rewatched Rat Pack, and I like it quite a bit. I do agree with your discussion regarding the pacing of it. And there were quite a few unnesscary one liners. I really thought that they did a good job with Tony Blundetto though. His introduction to me seemed the most human thing. Or if nothing else, he was given the most characterization of the Class Of 04 so far. I enjoyed the idea of his daughter being missing, etc, and him not backing down by the end of the hour. I would have been very disenchanted if they had introduced him like Richie or something of that sort. I am glad he wasn't hounding people for owed money, or looking to reclaim old turf.
I think Blundetto will turn out to be very interesting. Especially with the casting choice. I think for an actor of Mr. Buschemi's caliber, they would be very wrong to give him anything but top shelf material.
It does seem very off for The Sopranos, in terms of just throwing him in there, without a mention of him in the past four seasons. They could have probably written it a little better, his introduction to the family, so I do agree with you there. It is glad to see someone else who wasn't claiming Season Two was the best year, and who also wasn't crazy about Noody Knows Anything. I remember watching it, and shaking my head. Then they completly got back on track with Isabella.

</p>

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

Didn't see a thread devoted to this elsewhere, and this ep's topic list is already getting very unwieldy, so I'll just post this here.

Someone on another board raised the interesting point that the missing daughter (Kelly) whose picture was on Quentina's wall resembled very much a girl seen coming out of Melfi's group therapy last week. When I read this, I did an "oh yeah" because I knew there was something familiar about the girl in the photo. She's pretty distincitve, what with that satanic cult-like hair and dress and body piercings.

Tony also lingers glances on two people exiting that therapy: this girl and the lady that exited after (who was writer Robin Green in a cameo). I always just focussed on Robin Green because I thought that was sort of a cute inside joke for the staff, Gandolfini looking at Green like she's some wierdo loser as she leaves, and Green returning the favor with a dismissive glance. But now I wonder if the more imporant point was the girl. Tony looking at her like that could have been because he thought he recognized her as Tony B's daughter, probably confused by what I presume is a long passage of time since he last saw her and the profound physical changes that young people go through during adolescence.

Some are speculating that therapy girl is one and the same as Kelly. Others said that she is the twin of Kelly. I'll have to rewatch to clarify, but I thought Tony B's "twins" were separate and distinct from Kelly, that he had 3 kids.

In any case, has anyone noticed this or formed an opinion as to how similar looking the two girls actually are?

Part of me says this is too pat, too convenient for Chase to use -- Tony and his first cousin once removed going to the same psychiatrist. But then Chase does occasionally acknowledge the improbable coincidences of life -- like in the pilot with Melfi and Tony dining at the same restaurant (and again in season 2) or like Elliot's unknowing, chance encounter with Tony in the parking garage or his daughter's improbable conversation with Meadow about the law center. So there definitely is "Chase precedent" for playing on this kind of coincidence.

I actually hope the girl IS Kelly (or her twin) because that part of last night's exposition, along with the incident that led to Tony B's arrest, had me more intrigued than anything. That MELFI would be involved somehow in a bridge in this situation, undoubtedly unaware at first of the connection, is really interesting.

</p>

[harmony2k66]

Time to rewatch Two Tonys and Rat Pack. See if those two are the same

</p>

[harmony2k66]

Someone like Tony Soprano would defintly do a double take on someone with all black and the piercings. Yet, that could also be taken as him seeing if he recognized her. I hope they do bring Blundetto's daughter back, and I really hope it was the patient in Melfi's session. The onl bad thing, Tony did look at that picture, and if he had seen her, I would think he would have said something. That picture of her wasn't too old. Then again, who knows how long the time lapse between Two Tonys And Ratpack is. If we are taking Season Three Time, it cold be months. WEhich would make him not mentioning that more possible.

</p>

[harmony2k66]

If it plays out that Kelly is indeed a patient of Melfi's, I don't think it would be too easy for Tony to get the info about her from melfi. Then again, he is a mobster, and we saw how easy Jackie Jr, was found. That would be a very interesting plot point if Tony tried to find out about her through Melfi. Would defintly heat things up. I hope Melfi is back in "Where's Johnny".
I was thinking about it, and as far as compare ansd contrasts of the seasons go, last nights episode felt a lot like a Season Two Episode if anyone gets my drift. As far as the pacing, and direction.


</p>

[FlyOnMelfisWall]

I rewatched the pertinent parts of those eps, and I agree with you, harmony. It could go either way. She looks like she could be the girl, but there's just not enough to tell for sure. I suppose another option I hadn't thought of before is that the therapy girl was supposed to remind Tony of Kelly -- just look like her -- to sort of set the stage for this guilt that he's apparently repressed for the first four seasons.

I also agree Melfi wouldn't ever give up patient info to Tony. I'm thinking more along the lines (if the girl is Kelly) that Melfi slowly begins to put 2 and 2 together on her own and realizes there is a connection between Tony and Kelly and perhaps invisibly uses what she gains from each of them in sessions with the other.

But I'm probably wasting time giving it this much thought until we actually find out this wasn't a random coincidence. Hurry up "Where's Johnny"!

</p>

[harmony2k66]

FlyOnMelfi'sWall Writes:

But I'm probably wasting time giving it this much thought until we actually find out this wasn't a random coincidence. Hurry up "Where's Johnny"!

I couldn't agree with you more FOMW. For that matter, I can't wait until I own this whole Season on VHS.

</p>

[amytoilet]

FlyonMelfi'sWall, good eye. I hadn't considered it but rewatching the Two Tonys bit with the therapy girl it'd make sense to give the character a tiny window as a hint of things to come.

Anyway, I took two screen shots to see if the therapy girl and the photograph of Tony B.'s daughter could be very well the same person:

http://www.boomspeed.com/mediawhoring/twotonys.JPG

http://www.boomspeed.com/mediawhoring/ratpack.JPG

Is she or isn't she?


</p>

[moth78]

Hey, FOMW, I wasn't trying to offend or tell anyone how to watch the show. Wasn't trying to give a pep talk either. Just putting in my two cents on what seemed like a negative streak to the commentary.

As for your points, I agree with a lot of them... individual moments didn't quite work as well as they probably could have. Especially the out-of-the-blue moment from Agent Sanseverino. But I felt like for the sake of the season arc, this writer had quite a lot of expositionary work to do. Hence what seemed like a choppy episode. I think the way things were handled were for the most part effective, not brilliant, but overall solid.

In terms of writing quality, it's not "Employee of the Month" or "Knight in White Satin Armor" or even "Pine Barrens"... but it's not "Christopher" either.

And don't forget, the head writer, the producers, the director, certain people from HBO and of course David Chase still had final say on what was on screen, the way this episode was written and edited... so I don't think all blame should fall on the shoulders of the writer.







</p>

[homerofthesea]

I thought it was one of the more brilliant episodes ever. Tons of great lines, scenes, individual moments. Lots of exposition, too, handled pretty masterfully if you ask me.

</p>

[homerofthesea]

Great Lines"

"He invented point shaving."

"You're crowding me."

"Do you let that dry before you put on the second coat?"

"Great. Now I'm upset."

Scenes:

Tony drunk

Tony talking to Tony B. drunk

Tony B massaging Paulie and company.

Scenes with the FBI


</p>

[harmony2k66]

When Patsy came in to the bing, he told Tony that a friend of his on the force had ran the plates of a car outside where Tony was meeting "Black" Jack. It came back a No Hit, which means it wasn't registered, and was a governent audio mobile. This sparked Tony's suspricions so he went and met him again. Patting him downb, etc, and Jack was pretty nervous and out of the blue ,"Have you lost some weight".
Tony kinda liked the guy but wasn't sure how to proceed. After a drunken stupor, and he realized he hadn't lost any weight, he took care of it.


</p>

[kevtan]

I am missing the Second show of this season. Does anyone have it. I will make it worth your time. Please email me so I can watch shows 3 and 4 soon. Thanks Kevin
kevtan@aol.com

</p>

[Lady Soprano <3]

Great episode but while i am a fan of steve i like him behind the camera more then infront of it..lol